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Re: Whistling Billy Replica
Posted by: Mike L Clark (---.range31-48.btcentralplus.com)
Date: November 15, 2013 03:11PM

I've used Lumiweld - there is a fine point between melting the Lumiweld and melting the workpiece but that apart it is a very useful product. The Lumiweld itself, although of a low melting point, is quite a lot harder than the aluminium so finishing off ny filng to a level surface needs care.



Edited 2 times. Last edit at 11/16/13 05:18AM by Mike L Clark.

Re: Whistling Billy Replica
Posted by: Mike L Clark (---.range31-48.btcentralplus.com)
Date: November 15, 2013 03:18PM

Here are before and after Lumiweld on mangled aluminium drain hole covers. They are about 50mm long
Mike



Edited 1 times. Last edit at 11/15/13 03:36PM by Mike L Clark.

Attachments: DSCF6084 small.jpg (228kB)   P1000038vsmall.jpg (198kB)  
Re: Whistling Billy Replica
Posted by: (217.39.7.---)
Date: November 15, 2013 04:19PM

Hello Mike,
Thank you for the Lumiweld info. I have been into our local welding shop and I have a similar product which I will try first.

I have been to varous experts today and we have worked out a plan for the main bearings. The front two I will make an outside case and fit in a roller that fits the inner shaft. These have no thrust action on the crankshaft.
The rear two we hope to salvage with grinding or possibly CNC machining the ways with ceramic tips and then fitting larger balls.

In the mean time I am going to sort Billy's leaking pressure regulator.
Bob

Re: Whistling Billy Replica
Posted by: Donald Cook (---.range86-144.btcentralplus.com)
Date: November 16, 2013 11:59AM

Bob,

Hard machining using ceramic tooling is fine for surfaces for seals to run on or even thrust lips of radial and taper roller bearings but I would suggest that any race ways of ball or roller bearings are ground.

Don


Re: Whistling Billy Replica
Posted by: (---.range31-51.btcentralplus.com)
Date: November 17, 2013 08:51AM

Hello Don,
You could well be right. I have consulted several people locally and this firm have done several bearings for ECLP(English China Clay) this way and consider the job to be as good profiling with a CNC machine as grinding. I am still in doubt but the boss is making some enquiries and consulting others. The material he believes is not too hard to cut using ceramic tips and he tells me that the surface will be very good.
Do you know anyone in your area who would regrind the grooves to take balls 0.5MM larger divided between the two surfaces?
Bob

Re: Whistling Billy Replica
Posted by: Donald Cook (---.range86-144.btcentralplus.com)
Date: November 17, 2013 01:51PM

Hello Bob,

At Torrington’s we manufactured roller bearings up to 4 feet in diameter and 4 feet wide ( 4 races) and used CNC’s with ceramic tooling for stock removal to save time on grinding but we always finish ground the races, we found hard machining could not produce the required surface finish, but no doubt things may have moved on in recent years.

Sorry but I don’t have any contacts up here but when I renewed the crankshaft on my Stanley one of the eccentrics was pitted so I had this and its strap reground to take 1mm oversize balls by Goolds. I also believe Mark Drake had his eccentrics reground by someone else and was very happy with the results.

Don

Re: Whistling Billy Replica
Posted by: Mike L Clark (---.range81-154.btcentralplus.com)
Date: November 17, 2013 03:14PM

Bob

what about HB Bearings?

[www.hb-bearings.com]

They do this kind of thing all the time.

Mike

Re: Whistling Billy Replica
Posted by: (---.range86-156.btcentralplus.com)
Date: November 30, 2013 04:29AM

Thank you for all the advice. I am quite impressed by the ceramic tool finishes but I have sent the parts off to HB Bearings to see what they can do.
I have had a poor week with an attack on my computer followed by many people on my mailing list getting requests for money as I am stranded in Latvia- I assure you I am here in West Cornwall and I apologise if you have suffered from this. Most of my week has gone in trying to sort the problems on my computer and it is now apparently OK.
I am now about to tackle the rusty flywheel with it's 1inch block-chain drive wheel which needs remaking. I have the flywheel at about half its original weight on Billy so I can clean up the rusty mess with room to spare. I just need to keep it true to the crankshaft mounting plate which luckily is quite good.
I am also going to repair the aluminium sump and crank case which have corroded quite badly. I have already started on the crank-case feet, the four mounting blocks. The bronze one is ready and I am sorting the three steel ones which need almost remaking as they are so rusty.
Bob

Re: Whistling Billy Replica
Posted by: (---.range86-156.btcentralplus.com)
Date: December 6, 2013 07:16AM

6.12.2013
The flywheel is now cleaned up and machined down to size. It took a good sixteenth of an inch to get through the rust in some places but I had plenty of room to spare as Billy’s flywheel is about half the weight of the standard car. I want to leave enough meat on it in case I need to put a flywheel brake back on the car although I find the rear wheel brakes with their 12 inch drums quite adequate so far. If I were to put it on, I would need the brakes coupled together and carefully balanced so as not to cause damage in the transmission. This structure would add some weight (I do not have the flywheel casing holding the flywheel brake on Billy at present or the shoes and levers) and there is always the problem of keeping the brake lining off the surface in this type of brake. That could be for the future. Unfortunately we do not have Whites plans for Billy and do not know this type of detail.
In the centre of the flywheel is the female square which receives the prop-shaft male 3 ½ inch A/F square. This is a press fit and is held on with the 4 bolts which hold the flywheel onto the crankshaft. It allows the prop-shaft to move forward about an inch to take up any rear axle movement. Unfortunately this had been taken off this engine and is missing. I will probably have to make one unless someone out there has a spare.
As an alternative to this I am considering putting on a modern coupling with rubber between the surfaces. In many ways this would be sensible as this car has no give anywhere in the transmission which is partly why it is so liable to twisting the crankshaft. In the days when it was racing on dirt, the surface was more forgiving than the tarmac that it runs on now.
I am attaching before and after machining pictures of the flywheel and a picture taken from underneath the square on Billy -sorry, I am not dismantling that one for a better picture at present!
Bob

Attachments: Rusty flywheel (S).jpg (103kB)   flywheel after machining.JPG (222kB)   Square on flywheel.JPG (219kB)  
Re: Whistling Billy Replica
Posted by: (---.range86-152.btcentralplus.com)
Date: December 7, 2013 04:43AM

7.12.2013
The next problem with the flywheel is the chain wheel fitting on the front of it. That drives the oil pump and on Whistling Billy the rev counter/speedometer. On the standard cars, it also would drive the large four bladed condenser fan which I am told is a 3hp fan. The earlier cars had a lighter fan and belt drive from this pulley. I expect that Billy would cope with this with no condenser fan but I want a good positive oil pump drive.
Both the chain drive wheel and the driven wheel have 22 teeth for their 7 1/4 inch diameter. The chain that fits this is a 1inch block chain and is now very hard to find but I want to keep this type of chain on the car as it is part of the history. An interesting note here is that the whole set up is made simple based on pi being 22/7. With the centres of each chain link as 1inch, the number of teeth being 22, it does not take a master mind to work out the diameter as 7 inches( pi x D) and just add the chain width to give a little poke through for each tooth).
My 1908 White has the original chain with solid sides either side of the blocks –this one is very worn and stretched now.
I managed to purchase another chain that was caked in oil and mud at the Great Dorset Steam Fair a few years ago. It cleaned up very well but does have some wear. This has holes in the side plates and each link can be removed. When tightened it locks together. I am using this one on Billy. I have a short length spare but not enough for my spare engine chain.
I am having two new chain sprockets laser cut but will have to remake the centres when I get them back. The wheel is pressed into the flywheel and fitted with 4 machine screws which are riveted over. Three of these screws actually came undone from the rusty mess and I just had to drill out one.

Does anyone have any spare 1 inch block chain?

Attachments: 1908 White chain.JPG (175kB)   Top Chain wheel.JPG (231kB)   Billy\'s block chain.JPG (218kB)  
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